BBC News is reporting that a Brazilian judge has ordered YouTube to remove video clips of model Daniela Cicarelli from its site. "...despite YouTube's efforts to withdraw the clip it keeps appearing on the site." The fines could be as much as $119,000 per day.

We have always wrestled with how much control we should have over the content on MobyGames. Wikipedia uses a very democratic model where any person can upload and edit content with great success. MobyGames has gone to great lengths to ensure we are on the correct side legally and ethically. To the extent that some contributors consider MobyGames an "adventure in nitpicking". Should MobyGames open up even more? What about the issues raised in this latest YouTube case?

You should edit your reply in that thread where you refer to NHL 98 as an example of games with sub-par descriptions, as it has been revised by now.

Personally I think fining them for something they cannot control is stupid.

Then again, I think the Japanese media sucks for forcing them to remove clips from Japanese TV too.

I think it would really be cool to post music clips and movies of game play, but that would be unwise. There is a feeding frenzy of copyright lawyers looking for any infraction of copyrights.

Mobygames is a great project, and I'd hate to see it face any copyright challengers.

Perhaps that could push them towards implementing better control mechanisms then?

Yeah yeah whatever, so uhm... about the model's video, what are we talking about here?

Edit: ahhhh it's THAT kind of video. Nice!

With not much of THAT in it, I must say...

Agreed :(

Nobody should be prosecuted for noncommercial copying of stuff that has been available to the public for free in the first place.

And if she doesn't want to be seen, maybe she shouldn't have become a model.

My question is: can Youtube even control what videos are put up on the site?

If not, then there's really no case to sue for. Its the users' faults for uploading them repeatedly.

The problem is that she doesn't want to be seen doing THAT, but anyway, she shouldn't be doing it at a beach.

Oh well, she got her share of publicity from it. I don't know how much she is know outside Brazil (despite the fact of being Ronaldo's ex-wife), but she's got a lot of charisma, and I don't think Brazilians like her more or less after that video (maybe more, heh).

If this place opens up it's gonna be a mess. What I love about moby is that even in the most heated argument there's no nonsense (ie: the one about moby making money off of our contributions). The professionalism of this site and the way it's operated as well as the openness and intelligence of the leading members and admins are a rarity online. Years ago I used to subscribe to gamewallpapers and that sexist little boy who runs it runs that place like a fascist. He'd let sexist remarks on the message boards but if anyone questioned the quality of an image he'd band them. Trust me he did it to me and I cancelled my subscription early. Anyway, I guess that was a story I wanted to share but regardless, don't take the strictness away. It's what makes this place legit.

Another reason why some quality control is good - someone reviewed Deer Avenger 2 on IMDb:

When i think of great movies, many come to mind. We have flicks like casablanca, the shawshank redemtion, schindler's list, and then we have Deer Avenger 2: Deer in the City. Breath taking it is. Simply breath taking. Actually now that i look at it i think it was a video game. And a good one at that. Possibly the best ever that isn't NHL 94. 10 out of 10

It could be excellent display of irony too, though.

Well, if it's displayed to the public, then it can be displayed more than one way, can't it? Just because some folk don't like something doesn't mean it's gonna go away. Millions of people hate cancer, but it doesnt mean it's just gonna disappear!

Another reason why some quality control is good - someone reviewed Deer Avenger 2 on IMDb:

Ha, I just entered that into the database about two days ago. While searching for release info I came upon that sad review. My immediate reaction was "what was this guy on?"

I have found it frustrating at times getting content onto MobyGames... I'd prefer it if MB did lean more toward easier addition/correction of entries... but I understand that the current system does ensure a very high quality database.

But for instance, I added wrong information for ZX Spectrum game, and despite trying a number of times to send in corrections, the release date for the game was not corrected. =/

We're always streamlining the approval process to make it more efficient, however corrections often take more work simply because there's an existing item that needs to be checked and a correction to it that needs to be checked. Common reasons for a delay include: being unable to verify a specific piece of information, or receiving conflicting information from "reliable" sources (this tends to happen more with older systems & games). To avoid this, it's important that you use the comment field to include any necessary information: Including why you think it should be corrected, that you were the one contributing the original item (if it's your mistake), any URLs/sources of information that you can verify this with.

Without these, the item might be WIPed (sent back) to you asking for more information or escalated if the approvers have conflicting information. Multiple corrections confuses us further as we go over the same process for all of them... and might not know that another correction with the same information is also being researched or sent back for more information.

I can't comment on your item specifically as I don't handle to do with the ZX Spectrum. Sorry.

Yeah, what you're saying makes sense. But I still feel like my correction was dead simple. Here's the game: Repton Mania for ZX Spectrum (a compilation). I submitted it with the release date of the Repton 1 original by mistake (1984).

So I found a reliable source (http://www.worldofspectrum.org/infoseekid.cgi?id=0011346) which clearly shows the release date of Repton Mania was 1989, and I duly cited that in the comment field. I think I gave up after the correction had been WIP'd back to me twice. =/ And still Repton Mania sits in the database with the wrong release date.

I know how incredibly lame it sounds, but I just want one of my favourite childhood games there in the database with correct info. =P

YouTube is now blocked nationwide in Brazil through DNS according to news sources, is that correct chirinea?

I've heard some rumors about it, but I don't know, I still can access it from my house...

Well, now I can't.

Edit: er, nevermind, seems that it's back.

What. The. ****.

That's as bad as all those cable companies BLOCKING FOREIGNERS from even looking at their schedules. (I'm looking at you, HBO!)

I don't call allowing anyone to upload and edit content to be a reflection of a democratic model, that sounds more like anarchy.

Nevertheless, wikipedia does not in fact do this. I went round and round with people over the plutonium article on wikipedia, where I had one single individual erasing my additions while the followers of the thread protested with no avail whatsoever. I was disallowed from posting on the topic by one person.

Aside from this I have to say that the owners of a website are responsible for its content. I can't allow public access and then when questionable material comes up say that I'm not responsible because I let anyone and everyone post whatever they want.

Still, who cares about a Brazilian fine? As long as you're not operating there, it's largely irrelevant. Furthermore, how was the fine issued? Did the lawyers for youtube go to Brazilian court, have a trial, and then lose? Doubtful. I'm willing to bet they're being fined more for ignoring Brazilian courts that allowing for this media to be present on their site.

I do! =P

well, of course :)

What I was meaning to say was, "who outside of Brazil that doesn't operate there cares about a Brazilian fine?

Well that certainly didn't last long before the judge reversed the decision on the ban.

Though...

The judge also warned that he could reinstate a YouTube ban in Brazil. He demanded that the service providers explain why they could not block the video alone and that YouTube explain why it could not use software to prevent the Cicarelli clip from popping back on the site.

Lol. I think the judge doesn't want to feel stupid at being ignored by YouTube. :D

Hm...software designed to prevent a specific video from being uploaded, when the video can easily have the name changed, file properties changed, and even the length changed. That would be some pretty impressive software that can "watch" all the clips and automatically know what is being displayed in the clip and if it's acceptable or not.