Forums > MobyGames > _-_ or reweiver_etulosba, please stop
Unicorn Lynx (181788) on 9/22/2014 4:49 AM · Permalink · Report
Okay, so it turns out that this guy is the same as that guy. Check out his latest review.
Now, I approved it, and I don't think it should be removed. But seriously, this has to stop.
Whatever your real name is, please stop your obsession with my reviews. I honestly have no idea which part of them annoys you to the point of writing your own review for a game you most probably haven't even played that focuses exclusively on pathological problems you seem to have with whatever I write.
Also, voting my review unhelpful with two accounts is kind of cheap, if you ask me.
Just focus on your own life and your own taste in games, okay? This site doesn't really need reviews full of vague and, dare I say, somewhat deranged personal attacks. Have fun playing games and try not to focus to much on other people's work.
See, if I want to re-write a review a thousand times then I should be able to do so - unfortunately, this is really none of your business. I hope you understand that. If you are annoyed by the fact new versions of my older reviews appear on the front page, please take it with the admins. Have a nice day.
Rik Hideto (473498) on 9/22/2014 5:01 AM · edited · Permalink · Report
Sorry to intrude... but... you only noticed about this now? You guys are not that "naive", right? :-)
I already knew since last December (when I started reading the forums (old threads)) that "reweiver_etulosba" (he was using a totally different nickname at that time) is -... And same thing with FatherJack (Hello X)). ;)
So obvious. I don't belive that people who are into this site (much more than me I presume) don't notice about these things....
Anyway... lol... Peace out.
EDIT: It would be nice/fair if these users (with multiple accounts) could merge their pages (points)... hehe.
Unicorn Lynx (181788) on 9/22/2014 5:06 AM · Permalink · Report
Yeah, I only noticed now, but that's because I only vaguely remembered that person. He did write to me some very strange messages, but they weren't as hostile as now, so I just let it be. Also, he didn't write reviews obsessed with criticizing mine, so I didn't think his multiple personality was worth investigating :)
Unicorn Lynx (181788) on 9/22/2014 5:07 AM · Permalink · Report
EDIT: It would be nice if these users (with multiple accounts) could merge their pages (points)... hehe.
Actually, yeah. I don't quite understand why they create multiple accounts in the first place. Why would you want to split precious points between different aspects of your own ego? :)
Rik Hideto (473498) on 9/22/2014 5:32 AM · edited · Permalink · Report
Just wanted to say that I deeply respect FatherJack as a contributor and don't care if he showed his hairy ass before. Lame things happen. :)
You guys think it's "normal" a new contributor suddenly appearing (out of nowhere) and submitting loads of stuff within weeks? Normally (or always?), a new contributor starts slowly... :)
About the Italian guy, I'm not into reviews, but I actually like his "ramblings". Is it possible having him as an approver in the near future...? Between an "insane guy" (who makes the site working by approving stuff) and an "apparently normal" approver (who doesn't make the site working at all), I prefer the "insane" one...
My contributions actually depends on the approvals... the faster you approve, the more I will contribute. ;)
Unicorn Lynx (181788) on 9/22/2014 7:08 AM · Permalink · Report
Here is the PM he sent me in response:
what about the fact you know it was both times me to vote your "reviews" as unhelpful? Is it cheap? Or expensive?
:)))
I opened your pm coz I am not sleeping at 9 am.. and it's no time for clear mindedness. Won't do it again, so, bye, dont send anything anyway. You dont want to re-write.. you only want to occupy the stage, like a Chief clown.
Hey, youbforgot to tell people what tonality your "wife" prefers. Who knows it is B minor? It was mine. A very sad one.
The sad thing is that I have no idea whatsoever what I could have done to upset him to the point of throwing those vague insults at me. I really, really don't want to quarrel with anyone, but I'd like that to stop. It's unpleasant to see those PMs in my inbox every time I go to MobyGames.
Unicorn Lynx (181788) on 9/22/2014 8:27 AM · Permalink · Report
Wow, this is getting out of hand. After I sent him a message asking him to explain to me what I did to offend him, he sent me the following PM:
you wrote that Israel joins European sport competitions because in their area they are not "liked" :)) What an.. euphemism. If it was a matter of "like", this would imply all other countries in the world, playing sport games versus each other with no problem as they are, like each other? :)) The whole world, every where and at any time in history, has loathed the Jews. Do you ever happen to wonder why? * Talk to the admins? You know, beings of your kind are always sitting on high ranked chairs, or licking the boots of chiefs. The admins would say that you are right and I am wrong, before/without reading my message. This world is a place where beings of your ilk "win" :). You are even so lucky to feel those as wins! Sometimes, when I remember your thread to celebrate the yearly contributor chart 1st rank, or many other things, I feel pity for you for a moment. But you don't deserve pity. There is not a drop, not a shadow, not a wee.. of heartfelt passion for videogames in you. That "statement" of yours I referred to in Mr. Bones review is the best expression of disrespect to videogames I can recall. As for pathologies, I am lucky mine are not of the same kind of yours. Perhaps if nature made me as ugly as it made you, I would develop some complexes.. who knows. One thing I know is my pathologies won't be cured by Hu Jintao or Xi Jinping (I have heard they love to cure people with certain pathologies, and it seems it's exactly the pathologies I have…). *** Yes, I didnt play Mr. Bones. But that was a fun joke review (still, it scared you to the degree that you asked it not to appear on home page ahaha.. what a baby). You don't genuinely play games you review "seriously".. it's more serious a matter. But as long as you, and the simple-minded people whose flattering is among your vital purposes are ok with this, it's fine with me too. And you don't need to authentically play games; your knowledge of vgame history is so vast, so august, so stately I dare say, that allows you fill every "review" with stuff.. not mecessarily needing to be there, but, who cares? What matters is nobody realises that ;).
Back to admins.. you see.. my Mr. Bones review wasn't put on home page :)) While you occupied again the top position, after a 2-hour break. You name this "rewriting reviews as long as you like"? I am sure that's not the right name for this behaviour. If we include the admins who allow this and did hide my Mr. Bones review, a name could be "mafia"? But I won't even despise you and them any longer, for this... it's connate with human nature, not something a responsibility for should be adressed, then. It's the world. You are ordinary, there's persons like you wherever power, dispotism, money, and chance for exhibition are. * It's good for him, Jesus/the Messiah I mean, that like us all he was dust, and is not watching us from the afterworld. How would he feel, otherwise, seeing that among his devouts there is one who every 5 minutes says/thinks/feels he is "proud of" something he did/does/will do? :))) p r o u d: the most Jesus-like of words, clearly… Proud of composing a genealogy when a primary school student. I am so short minded I can't see how, why, what. Unluckily, we aren't all as intelligent as you… very few are, and thankfully, we aren't all as cowardly, cocky, vain, peacock-like, superficial, as you… And what about Heine, Shakespeare, Dostoevskij? It's good they can't see how shamelessly you offend them by untimely placing their name in videogame reviews where they have no clean reasons to stay at all. Just because you need someone know you know those authors :))! I am amused to see my unhelpful rating uneased you. How many times I did that? You don't need to personally dig or ask your pet admins to do it for you, no investigation is needed anymore. It should be 5 games. 3. 7? I can't remember.. I care much less than you. I guess you would judge it honest to express a sincere vote for each of your 297 reviews. Well, I'll spare the remaining 290 of them from even a single unhelpful rating, that I'd honestly give. Cheer up.. like Jews always happen to, you got a very favourable deal here ;) I am not sure Dostoevskij would have investigated or asked the admin to do so, if he were you today… and what about the Messiah? He would very likely have not, I dare presume. When you have your friendly chats with your pet admins, tell them I congratulate them for both hiding my Mr. Bones review and for an user of the site can know about votes that should be nameless. Well, man. Let me bet, you don't like Čhechov. Give a look to his short recount "Gusev", or "Gus'ev" ;) And.. can you remember the dialogue between Jesus and the Grand Prosecutor in the Karamazov? Not a dialogue, a meeting.. as Jesus, wisely, did not speak a word. That prosecutor was a portrait of you.. and now I hear you are befriending with Jesus? How contradictory.. ah, yes, contradictions are everyday's bread for clowns and mask play actors. It is not that you are a liar; you are a lie; yet since you lie to yourself too, one can't accuse you of anything.. it's all fair. Now that I remember.. this is you. An arrogant kid. Remember that blog, where someone blamed Moby using urbane words, and you came into play being the first to use names such as "idiotic"? Indra joined too. Things ended with that man and Indra talking politely, and you insulting, and, that's the funny side, left alone with your insults. More humiliating still, that man continued to politely reply to your civil statements, ignoring only the bad words. Just like a wise adult would do, in front of a problematic boy. I am certain you never got, nor will you ever, got conscious of that. Just for this I should envy you; I would, if I were able to envy anyone. ** This is our last interaction. I won't mention/refer to you anymore, in direct or indirect way. Yesterday I realised I offend me, if I do. maybe one day I'll describe you on my blog. Or go to that man's blog and tell that at MobyGames there is someone who can spy other users, and sharply abuse of home page and top position on home page. Maybe not. Maybe I'd offend me, again, if I do this. We'll see.. who cares! What I care for is, I wont read any possible message from you anymore. Don'tvforget to congratulate the admins on my behalf :)
I think that crosses the line in more ways than one.
Patrick Bregger (298433) on 9/22/2014 9:42 AM · edited · Permalink · Report
What did I just read. My head hurts.
Cavalary (11445) on 9/22/2014 11:21 AM · Permalink · Report
Considering certain personal experiences, I'm getting more and more supportive of contributors that have issues with specific approvers and with the way such conflicts are handled by the higher ups, if/when they are at all, including or perhaps especially if they start making a mess to force a response.
That said... what the hell is that? Also the reviews I read, huge rambling blocks of text that just make my head hurt. (And why should this latest one be approved / stay there, exactly? Could go into those short-form reviews the ownership keeps threatening with occasionally (as long as they'll be entirely separate from the "proper" ones), those shouldn't even need approval, but what makes this a real review?)
Also, this seems to have little to do with the site other than picking a whole lot on an annoyance that has a whole lot more to do with how the site works and not that much with you (meant to use 3rd person but can't write that nick unless I open the thread again and copy it :p), and a whole lot with picking a preferred target for some rather disturbing personal biases.
Would fully support a drive to change how things are done regarding reviews, including what shows up on the front page and where (but also starting from only allowing serious and at least decent (quality-wise) ones), and including by making quite a mess over it, but this seems to be largely using that as an excuse for something else.
CalaisianMindthief (8172) on 9/22/2014 1:44 PM · Permalink · Report
What a load of bull.
Indra was here (20760) on 9/22/2014 8:26 PM · edited · Permalink · Report
Eh? How did my name get dragged in here? o_O
munches popcorn
Francesco Azzena (2) on 9/22/2014 4:35 PM · Permalink · Report
He has some points.. You are everywhere, you don't leave space for others to contribute and you write useless comments in the image description space that sometimes don't relate with the game but are your own personal ideas.. You talk too much about yourself like you were trying to achieve constant attention centered on you.. That's pretty annoying to say the least.. I can understand its reasons.. And it's true there's a sorta "mafia", a group of users who think they own the place.. Sure they contributed to the site for years and even donated money but that's not a reason to fill every space that remains for the rest of us that lurk without anything to contribute because the OP or some of his friends had already did it.. Sorry to disagree but I think you're wrong.. And I'm being diplomatic trying to understand both reasons..
Fred VT (25953) on 9/22/2014 4:44 PM · Permalink · Report
Actually, there isn't a group of people that dominate everything and don't leave rooms for others. There is, however, a group of people who participate in discussions, suggest new ideas, contribute data and will seek new info to add whenever they can. Obviously, anyone who is an approver will see new info more often, as we have to do research to fill the gaps left in the contributor's submissions, and we gain experience that way.
As for Oleg taking much space? I must say I never noticed it. It may be because I am not interested in the same things as him (I barely ever read his reviews).
CalaisianMindthief (8172) on 9/22/2014 5:09 PM · Permalink · Report
Nothing to contribute? You must be joking. There are hundreds of thousands of games still missing from the database. We're severely lacking in MMOs, educational games, browser games, Japanese games, handheld games, casual games, recent console games, indie games etc. Not to mention even AAA games are added with severe delays. Find your niche and go banzai!
Unicorn Lynx (181788) on 9/22/2014 5:22 PM · edited · Permalink · Report
You are everywhere
I'm on this site. I've been with it for thirteen years now. Don't like it? Tough luck. Either deal with that or leave.
you don't leave space for others to contribute
In what way don't I "leave space"? Do I lock game entries from you? Do I tie your hands while you desperately trying to contribute?
Seriously, next time just think a little bit before posting this kind of baloney. The guys here have seen more skillful trolls.
and you write useless comments in the image description space that sometimes don't relate with the game but are your own personal ideas
That's because I captured the images and the approvers thought they were good enough even with those "useless" comments. Don't like them? Submit your own images. Or go to another site.
You talk too much about yourself like you were trying to achieve constant attention centered on you
Why would I want attention from people like you or your crazy compatriot? Don't you understand that I posted that because your friend was behaving - to put it very mildly - unprofessionally? He submitted a review that is actually not a review but a personal attack. Then, after I APPROVED his review, he sent me an openly antisemitic PM insulting everything he could think of: my ethnicity, my work, my wife, my religious beliefs... You've read it and you still honestly think that can be justified - regardless of whom he offends?
Francesco Azzena (2) on 9/22/2014 5:43 PM · Permalink · Report
It seems you can't fathom that some people don't do think for money but for ideas.. I wrote what I wrote because I think that. I didn't insult you but you did and in doing that you confirmed the idea I had of you.. I don't care if he is italian or my "compatriot".. I didn't even knew he was from Italy.. By the way I'm from Sardinia, I'm sardinian, I speak sardinian.. I'm not italian.. Italy conquered us but I'm not italian.. So he isn't my compatriot.. I don't care if you're a jew or a composer or if your wife is chinese or other things.. By the way if someone criticise you you must respond without using the "antisemite" argument otherwise people would think they're compelled to use the apartheid in Palestine argument, the Gaza bombing killing thousands of innocents argument or the zionist colonization with aliyas argument.. I personally don't want to discuss with you on these things.. I only suggested why maybe he thought he was compelled to use those arguments againts you.. Maybe you want to calm yourself and maybe ignoring him for some time would help you and the site would be a better place. If you don't want to hear arguments against you don't open threads because there is the possibility that someone would be against you or at least accept other points of view.. Greetings.
Unicorn Lynx (181788) on 9/22/2014 5:58 PM · edited · Permalink · Report
Why do you think you didn't insult me, Francesco? You said I was "everywhere"', I wasn't letting your contribute, etc. You don't think it's hurting to read this? I think it was mean and also very pointless, since everybody here know that I couldn't prevent you from contributing even if I wanted to. Sorry if my reply seemed insulting to you - I know it was sharp, that's because what you wrote hurt me. Which part of that is not clear?
Also, I don't understand why every personal attack on me has to end with anti-Israel or, moe broadly, anti-Jewish sentiments. Why? Can you give me one good reason what my behavior on this website, which you happen to dislike, has to do with my citizenship or ethnicity?
Unicorn Lynx (181788) on 9/22/2014 6:03 PM · Permalink · Report
. By the way if someone criticise you you must respond without using the "antisemite" argument
I didn't bring that into the discussion. Didn't you read the other guy's message? He was saying everyone has always hated Jews. I didn't mention anything about Jews or Israel in any discussion with him - or anybody else, for quite a while, with very good reasons, believe me.
So please, don't try to turn things around. He was the first to bring my ethnicity into this, not I. Same as you are the first to bring the Israeli-Palestinian conflict into this, not I. And I really want to know: why? You tell me.
Francesco Azzena (2) on 9/22/2014 6:13 PM · Permalink · Report
I didn't insult you.. Those were criticism not insults.. Insults are "faggot", "moron" and so on.. You know the semantic difference..
For the other point.. You took the "antisemite" argument in the discussion.. Not me..
I barely tried to think why HE thought HE was compelled to use those arguments againts you.. Sorry for my english but I'm not a native speaker so maybe I can make mistakes.. But this time I didn't..
By the way why I say you're everywhere because everytime I want to submit something you already did.. I am on this site ten years now and I saw you contribute everything..
Cavalary (11445) on 9/22/2014 6:48 PM · Permalink · Report
'scuse me for butting in, but you're on this site for ten years, want to contribute and only have 1 screenshot and 5 ratings under your name?
As for the names under "everything", the top contributors would tend to appear most frequently, it's sort of how it works, yes. So can we stick to actual reasons for complaint here? Because you do seem to be hurting your cause... and likely making others who may have issues look bad by it as well.
On the other hand, "deal with that or leave" and "go to another site" is not what should come out of the... fingers of an obvious community leader here (even if merely through force of the number of contributions).
Unicorn Lynx (181788) on 9/22/2014 7:26 PM · Permalink · Report
On the other hand, "deal with that or leave" and "go to another site" is not what should come out of the... fingers of an obvious community leader here (even if merely through force of the number of contributions).
I agree that was too sharp and hostile. I apologize for that. I typed that impulsively because Francesco's words seemed unnecessary hurtful. I still feel the same way, but I shouldn't have hurt him back.
I hope you understand that "you are everywhere, you don't let others contribute, and you are too full of yourself" is not something anyone would want to hear after eleven years of fairly intense volunteer work.
Unicorn Lynx (181788) on 9/22/2014 7:11 PM · edited · Permalink · Report
By the way why I say you're everywhere because everytime I want to submit something you already did.. I am on this site ten years now and I saw you contribute everything..
Really, I contribute EVERYTHING? What about the other guys, where do they get their points from?
Take a look at the Top 100 Contributors list of 2014. There are, what, twenty people who have contributed more than me, no?
Then why are you singling me out? Why, of all contributors and approvers, it is for some reason me you have this inexplicable dislike towards?
Francesco Azzena (2) on 9/22/2014 7:23 PM · edited · Permalink · Report
I was merely offering my point.. Forums are made for discussing not for dispensing truth..
Yes you hadn't submitted literally everything but look at your contribuition score.. It's huge!
You posted his message to you not me. You were butthurt not me.. I really don't care.. Like I said above I was merely offering my point of view..
Unicorn Lynx (181788) on 9/22/2014 7:28 PM · Permalink · Report
Yes you hadn't submitted literally everything but look at your contribuition score.. It's huge
Yes, I know it's huge, what I don't understand is why do you have a problem with that?
Are you implying that I, what, stole this points? Somehow manipulated people into giving them to me? I have so many points because I contributed a lot of stuff. Why is that bad?
Francesco Azzena (2) on 9/22/2014 7:50 PM · Permalink · Report
You're too present on this site.. And you make jokes in the comments space of the screenshots that aren't hilarious but you think so..
Rik Hideto (473498) on 9/22/2014 8:01 PM · Permalink · Report
[Q --start Francesco Azzena wrote--]Yes you hadn't submitted literally everything but look at your contribuition score.. It's huge! [/Q --end Francesco Azzena wrote--] I see some worship here. :) Yes, it's huge and yours is insignificant... but yet you think you can argue and stuff. Oh wait, it's the "spiritual presence", right? Those people who DON'T contribute at all with information, but are always lurking. Be my guest. :)
[Q --start Francesco Azzena wrote--]You're too present on this site.. And you make jokes in the comments space of the screenshots that aren't hilarious but you think so.. [/Q --end Francesco Azzena wrote--] Yeah, maybe you like those screenshots with captions like: "Kill Orc!", "Banana!", right?
Dude, too bad I can't "judge" your screenshots because you simply do not contribute to this site. Hah whatever... too much talk but no action. Peace out.
Francesco Azzena (2) on 9/22/2014 8:27 PM · Permalink · Report
See, you're the mafia I was talking about.. Every moment defending your privileged status in your little circle.. A bunch of cronies who defend each other..
Sorry but I don't care being insignificant.. I prefer this way..
I don't worship him at all.. I pity him.. Maybe he's not even who claims to be..
Maybe even you are a construct of your imagination..
Everyone knows the internet is full of mentals who live lifes full of attention seeking..
The reason I only submitted one image is because everything I wanted to submit had already been submitted by Yid Yang boy.. And I don't think those entries need other images..
j.raido 【雷堂嬢太朗】 (93195) on 9/22/2014 8:32 PM · Permalink · Report
[Q --start Francesco Azzena wrote--]See, you're the mafia I was talking about.. Every moment defending your privileged status in your little circle.. A bunch of cronies who defend each other..[/Q --end Francesco Azzena wrote--] Aha. Ahahaha. Ahahahahahaahaha.
Man. Wow.
Nope, there's no reason that people here might become friends when they share common interests and have been working together on an entirely volunteer project for, in some cases, more than a decade. Nope! It's all just collusion and circle-jerking! :D
Because we only do all this for the material rewards and infinite fame. Right? :D
Rik Hideto (473498) on 9/22/2014 8:37 PM · edited · Permalink · Report
Francesco, you are way too bored, right?
I actually feel your comment about the "mafia". I had exactly the same feeling few months/years ago... about the nationality thing, well, months ago there was a guy who assumed I was Chinese only because I have the Macau flag in my profile... pssstttt... lame.
I think your comment about the other guy screenshots really makes no sense. If you are so good, then why don't you upload some screenshots with TOP-NOTCH captions?
I have a suggestion for you. I know it sounds rude but... just GO AWAY, is that ok?
Oh and btw, I love Cagliari... not the soccer team because they are shit. I'm thinking about the city. ;)
Francesco Azzena (2) on 9/22/2014 8:45 PM · Permalink · Report
You know, I don't really care about winning.. You maybe care.. I don't..
I don't really neither about my city nor about the soccer team of my city..
No, I will stay just because it bugs you.
Yeah I read you're a hafu.. Did the other japanese make jokes of you at work because you're an hafu?
Rik Hideto (473498) on 9/22/2014 8:52 PM · edited · Permalink · Report
[Q --start Francesco Azzena wrote--]Yeah I read you're a hafu.. Did the other japanese make jokes of you at work because you're an hafu? [/Q --end Francesco Azzena wrote--]
WTF. :) Yeah, in Asia I'm an European. In Europe I'm an Asian... You know... hafus "tough" life. But I can't complain... Girls (hot ones, not Quasimodos) like hafus. ;)
Off... o/
Francesco Azzena (2) on 9/22/2014 8:38 PM · Permalink · Report
Good for you. But usually "friends" on the internet are not real and only the result of circle jerking as you say.. Been on dozens of forums.. Posted thousands of posts.. Seen everytime swarms of attention seeking losers with neckbeard and strange delusions about reality..
j.raido 【雷堂嬢太朗】 (93195) on 9/22/2014 8:42 PM · Permalink · Report
... :D
Rik Hideto (473498) on 9/22/2014 8:44 PM · edited · Permalink · Report
Mr. Azzena, I just saw your Facebook profile... and I'm not going to say anything. Ok, you are the normal person (ROFLOL!), the top contributors are all strange. Is that ok now? Happy?
Francesco Azzena (2) on 9/22/2014 9:01 PM · Permalink · Report
Please Mr. Hafu tell me from my Facebook profile how am I abnormal.. picks pop corns
Unicorn Lynx (181788) on 9/22/2014 7:21 PM · Permalink · Report
For the other point.. You took the "antisemite" argument in the discussion.. Not me..
No, I haven't. I merely pointed out that you are defending a person whose message to me contained antisemitic remarks. Or you don't think that what he wrote about Jews was antisemitic?
You also were the first to bring Israel into it. The name of that country was only mentioned in the other guy's post. I didn't even refer to that. But for some reason you felt obliged to drag that into the discussion. Why?
Also, while I have learned the hard way that no amount of discussions or explanations will ever change the mind of someone who hates Israel - common sense and common politeness dictate that you don't insult the country to which your opponent belongs in a discussion that has nothing to do with it. We are not discussing the Middle Eastern conflict here. We are discussing my behavior on this site and the reasons why you don't like it. So please let's leave politics out of this, ok?
Havoc Crow (29798) on 9/22/2014 8:17 PM · edited · Permalink · Report
Look - personally, I think that - or reweiver or whatever is suffering from some sort of a mental disorder. I don't mean to insult, I genuinely think he needs psychiatric help, judging from his creepy rambling messages. That said, continual and obsessive harassment of a member who has done him no wrong is absolutely unacceptable.
There's no point in arguing with him, he won't listen to rational arguments anyway.
Sciere (923814) on 9/22/2014 8:26 PM · edited · Permalink · Report
Just so that everyone is in the loop: don't talk to the guy, don't discuss anything outside the content of contributions in the queue, reject if he submits pointless revisions or refuses to amend his submissions. He wrote me a 2,500 word essay yesterday as well (one of the many), but I just ignore them. He's a professional troll or very much in need of the type of help he won't find here.
Simon Carless (1835) on 9/23/2014 12:53 AM · Permalink · Report
FWIW, I'm gonna lock this thread (providing I understand how to!) and speak to a couple of the involved parties - in general, the rule must be - don't feed the trolls :/ And I fear we are doing that!!