Now I've been thinking about St. Martyne and his threads. I often feel I want to sign my name under nearly each one of them. It's not that the two of us like exactly the same games. But we both have absolutely the same attitude. Like, the games are giving us the same vibes. I wonder why?

I don't know him in real life. I know lasttoblame, but we get absolutely opposite vibes from games. Totally different.

St. Martyne and I share a common cultural heritage. Very similar social circles. And even same ethnicity. Is it about that?

What do you guys think? How much does one's culture/social status/ethnicity influence his attitude towards gaming?

Being from England, I'm into Buzz!, SingStar and soccer games mainly. Like all of my fellow countrymen/women.

Seriously, though, I think your cultural identity may have *something* to do with your similar thoughts/opinions. Though not much. I reckon St_Martyne could come from Norway and you could come from Australia and still share very similar viewpoints.

I'm from Mexico. But I hate the GTA games. So I'm pretty sure the cultural aspect isn't valid in my case. :P

Hmmm, many Germans love managerial games, especially nation-building games like the Anno or the Settlers series. I'd play them too, if I wasn't an RPG addict and had more time on my hands.

But, to comment on your question, I think nationality/ethnicity is only a small part of our attitude towards gaming. More important are IMHO age and educational background, upbringing and the overall state of mind. :-)

Folding your socks in the evening? You're likely to do every side quest in RPG's. Having stress at work? You'll likely play calmer games, turn-based I guess. Difficult brain job? Likely a shooter player in the evening...

And so on.

I really doubt it has anything to do with ethnicity. But then again I have a complicated relationship with ethnicity and stuff - I'm like a critical anti-nationalist (Estonia is a lie) and a romantic nationalist (Fenno-Ugrica makes my heart go boom) at the same time.

For example the similarities we (you and I) might have in tastes have probably to do something with that I was an avid reader of your reviews in my formative years as a gamer (12-16). Then again, I was a story guy right from the beginning and followed you just because you were too.

But still, I don't think so. Martyne is my age and thus most likely grew up in the 90's. In 80's everything was a mass defiance against the Soviet Union, while the 90's were Capitalism: The Shady Years (oligarchs and stuff). It's like a completely different world to grow up in and stuff.

Perhaps some influence. But the largely deciding factor is in my opinion something else. I don't think it's educational background or upbringing either. It's just a gamer personality type I guess.

You and Martyne share a same ethnicity? Slavic jew?

Well, my grandmother was a jew, so our local Jewish community regards my father as one. You won't tell that from my looks, though. ;-)

And, yeah, reading lots of Oleg's reviews has definitely left its mark upon me as well. Apart from that, personality, habit and lots of other things I have no clue about.

Nevertheless, I am pretty convinced, that there are differences in gaming preferences between various countries, nationalities and people of different education backgrounds. But I am hard-pressed to name anything specific beyond the obvious Europe/Japan/US triangle and some vague points about obssesion with tentacles and Nordic spirits.

You and Martyne share a same ethnicity? Slavic jew?

Yup. Slavic warmth + Jewish intelligence = lady killer :-)

Please elaborate. Are Jews more intelligent, or does Jewish intelligence differ from ordinary intelligence?

Please elaborate. Are Jews more intelligent, or does Jewish intelligence differ from ordinary intelligence?

The second. Jewish intelligence is the kind of intelligence that works well with Slavic warmth :)

One of the best estonian writers and essayists is a slavic jew. Well by blood and name only - his father was a polish jew, and as I can tell from what he writes, apparently there were no bigger polish imperialists than polish jews. So he doesn't connect with that. And he did grow up as an estonian. But he's really great. Especially when you like that sort of socialist egalitarian mystical shamanistic worldview and writing.

(Estonia is a lie)

Why?

Remember when Herder was like the best thing after sliced bread? Well, estonians copy-pasted their nationalism from german nationalism. Which actually destroyed our multicultural heritage. That was all back in the 19th century. However, we've never reworked our nationalism into a more sane version, add the recent political involvement (xenophobia and programmed hatred for russians) with it... and well, it's just wrong. We're also taught to be very detached from the rest of eastern europeia, to the point where most estonians don't even know that some of their national cuisine comes from central asia. It needs to be reworked completely. I could discuss it in a more detailed manner if you're interested.


I'm not so sure about that. Personality is not something that the powers that be give you to live with, it's something that is your own. The core being is you alone, the one who surfaces in extreme situations. "…live with a man 40 years…share his house, his meals, speak on every subject…then tie him up and hold him over the volcano’s edge. On that day, you will finally meet the man." (Firefly) That's your true being, the rest is just a mask, whether you're aware of it or not.




Not agreed. Humans are hardly that different. There is always the working class and the rich class in every society and ethnicity. All societies work in a similar fashion. Socio-economical factor's influence us more than ethnicity, which is mostly just an illusion of the middle class. I like ethnicity, as I'm somewhat of a romantic nationalist, but really... we're not that different at all.

There is also the environmental influence. People living on the similar latitudes share certain traits - all "summers white all day/winters dark all day long" share a similar emotional unbalance and suicidal traits for example.

However, we've never reworked our nationalism into a more sane version

You guys just got your independence. Give it some time.

most estonians don't even know that some of their national cuisine comes from central asia.

Really, like what?

So you wanted to know why for me Estonia is a lie? Here's my story.

In 18th century, Estonia got a very thorough puritanical workout. The Moravians came here, and they really Jesus-ified the people. For a while there, everyone and their mothers here just loved Jesus a bit too much. In that old evil "happiness is a sin against God!" way of course. So they loved Jesus so much, that when the moravians told them that all those folk songs, folk dances, folk tales and folk customs are of the devil, then the people destroyed as much as they could to please Jesus.

Okay, as you probably know, the romantic nationalism movements of 19th century created it's ethnic flavors from the culture of peasants. Because the upper class cultures were always a bit too universal. "The spirit of the folk" was always the purest amongst peasants. Now everyone was like "peasants rock" and stuff. So was the middle-class of estonia in 19th century - "peasants kick ass! such amazing ethnicity... oh I'm so proud to be of one blood with these people." Almost.

Remember how brother Grimm's had to falsify their fairy tales because they just didn't have enough of that "eternal glorious germanic spirit oozing out from every syllable"? Well the estonian middle class looked what the germans did, and said "wow it's so cool and stuff" and tried to do the same thing. However something did not compute. They were looking for the same "teutonic spirit" because that was the example they knew. But sadly, for them, the estonian peasants just didn't have that "grand hardcore teutonic spirit".

So what happened was, that which was left of actual estonianity after the puritanical 18th century, was destroyed in the name of estonian nationalism that tried to make that estonianity into an "eternal spirit of the folk."

So that's one of my problems with official estonian identity. It's not estonian, but somekinda barren destructive artificial creation copypasted from something else that also ended up being a destructive artificial creation. You know your russian history, so in a way you can compare me to those slavophiles who felt that Peter I actually destroyed russian culture. My issue is somewhat similar.

My second issue is that the modern-day estonian nationalism wants to destroy what is left of finno-ugricness in our country. It wants to estonianize our indigenous people. In this case, they are indigenous because they have lived as long as we have in this territory, but they're not estonians but our fellow finno-ugric people, who actually have things left from their pre-christian past. They are more finno-ugric than we are. But we want to assimilate them so to protect "the estonian culture, people and language" from destinction. This is bullshit! We destroyed ourselves 150 years ago, we are living a barren artificial creation as our nation and now we want to destroy the few dynamic and natural cultures we have left. There's this anal protection of estonian language by law, to protect it. However this law also considers their language as just a "mutilated estonian" language. So why should they speak "funny estonian" language when they could speak "civilized and proper" estonian. So their schools aren't in their own language, but in official estonian. Also there's a new law in creation that wants to outlaw any usage of "peculiar" estonian in public places. Which would mean that every sign, commercial, things with writing on it has to be in estonian, all over estonia. No support is given for their different ethnicity, this creates social stigma's, and eventually ends in ethnocide. Nothing is taught of them, no mention in our history books. The powers that be want them to be assimilated because their nationalistic narrative would crumble if it would admit the multicultural nature of our history and land. Also, an actual living example that finno-ugric culture is shamanistic in nature is hard to accept when you've worked so long to maintain the "teutonic spirit".

My third issue is the programmed hatred for russians. Social stigma's are not carried by genes, but by the attitudes of your peers. There's this way we're taught to hate anything russian, anything slavic, in fact anything eastern european. It detaches us completely from reality. The weirdest things I've heard - "russians aren't white people", "every estonian recycles and votes for the green party, but it's in russian nature to throw garbage everywhere and to violate nature", "russians aren't human beings, as no human being would behave like that" , "russians smell", "russians are ugly", "russian language makes me want to throw up". I have a certain "ewww..." relationship myself with russian culture, but I've been working to overcome it ever since I realized it's source. And it's only gotten worse in recent years. It's like they want us to commit a mass suicide on the sacrificial altar of whatever dark god they worship.

And this summer, they raised a giant pink teutonic cross before the gates of Old Tallinn and waved torches and sang nationalistic freedom and "the spirit of the folk" songs that would have made Hitler proud. It was then when I fell to my knees and wept for the stupidity of mankind.

So that's why for me, Estonia is a lie.




Kefir, yoghurt, shishlyk. Shishlyk is like the food of summer solstice celebrations. You can't have proper summer solstice without shishlyk. Our shishlyk is done from pig however. Then there are also things like pilaf and pelmeni - but with these there still remains some idea that they're somewhat "alien". At least with pilaf, with pelmeni's I'm not so sure anymore.

There are other things, but I don't know all their names in english. Some things betray they're origin just with their names alone like kievski kotlet, but there is still a peculiar sense of detachment of how we've influenced each other and everything.

You should be a professional journalist, man, really. Thank you for this bit of entertaining and educational material :)

You know your russian history

It's not mine, but yeah, I know what you mean :)

so in a way you can compare me to those slavophiles who felt that Peter I actually destroyed russian culture.

But Peter has dragged the country out of the quagmire it was stuck in for centuries. He made Russia to a (halfway) civilized country. They had to go through the globalization process, otherwise they'd stagnate and die. It's not that he outlawed Russian folk customs or something. When you pull a country out of its isolationist misery, you've gotta make sacrifices. Can't please everyone. Lots of people hated Ataturk in its day, but now most Turks probably say "Thank you, Ataturk, for making us a modern country instead of letting us stuck in the Middle Ages like our neighbors. We forgive you for cutting off the heads of some stubborn mullahs who were slowing down the giant pace of our national history".

And this summer, they raised a giant pink teutonic cross before the gates of Old Tallinn and waved torches and sang nationalistic freedom and "the spirit of the folk" songs that would have made Hitler proud. It was then when I fell to my knees and wept for the stupidity of mankind.

So that's why for me, Estonia is a lie.

The existence of nationalist idiots doesn't mean that the country they worship in their perverted way is a lie. I don't want to be tempted to think that Israel is a lie because sometimes some wackos there gather together and chant "The promised land is so and so big, screw anyone who gets in our way" (luckily, there seem to be less and less of those).

Neither is China a lie because it is ruled by a pack of cheaters who spread a terrible education system that brilliantly calls a combination of general ignorance, moronic nationalism, and merciless capitalism a happy communist state.

And I mean, what should Germans do? Stop loving Germany because not such a long time ago a bunch of assholes taught them to love it in a sick, demented way?

with pelmeni's I'm not so sure anymore.

I heard that pelmeni was a real Finno-Ugric thing. The word definitely has this kind of sound, right?

But Peter has dragged the country out of the quagmire it was stuck in for centuries. He made Russia to a (halfway) civilized country.

Oh I agree with that. It's just that the issue they had is similar to what I have.

Unrelated rant: From the estonian point of view relationships with Russia has been great when Russia is Novgorod/Peterburg, and bad when Russia is Moscow. From the estonian perspective, all Moscow rulers share similar traits, it's like there are some dark spirits in the halls of Kremlin that possess people.

The existence of nationalist idiots doesn't mean that the country they worship in their perverted way is a lie.

It wasn't nationalist idiots, but government-initiated construction. It was built by the military and it's ministry. It was official. It was meant to be the eternal cross that would burn on eternally and shine the light of whatever stupid thing it shines for, but the materials were low-quality and it turned pink. So that was funny actually in the end. But for a while there it was just sad.

Also, my statement was meant to conclude all of the text above it, not just that thing.

Neither is China a lie because it is ruled by a pack of cheaters who spread a terrible education system that brilliantly calls a combination of general ignorance, moronic nationalism, and merciless capitalism a happy communist state.

Estonia: moronic 19th century nationalism, Milton Friedman is Jesus Christ, CIA building some secret prison camps on our territory (okay that was Lithuania, but still), xenophobic near-racist conservatism (Fox News would feel home here), ignorance of it's roots, history books very euro-white man civilizes the world from filthy savages-centric, we're waging war in Afghanistan "for our independence", local christianity being actually an extension of american nationalism and manifest destiny... and lots of other things I can't think of right now.

And I mean, what should Germans do? Stop loving Germany because not such a long time ago a bunch of assholes taught them to love it in a sick, demented way?

I hope you don't mean things like fatherland and patriotism and stuff. Because, for me those things are evil and precisely the wrong influence of 19th century germanic nationalism. I'm people-oriented, country-worshiping is like worshiping a false god, a golden calf for me. A country has to earn one's respect and loyalty, by proving that it stands for the right egalitarian humanist ideals.

I heard that pelmeni was a real Finno-Ugric thing. The word definitely has this kind of sound, right?

Yeah they are. Siberian Finno-Ugric. But they overlap with various mongolian and turkic peoples, so who can tell.

Which reminds me that our indigenous people - the Seto - still have certain customs and folky things that makes one realize how close the finno-ugric people are... in a way that Uralic-Altaic theory has a point. Okku the Bear God was like something out of Seto folklore. But estonians are completely cut off from that world.

I'm people-oriented, country-worshiping is like worshiping a false god, a golden calf for me.

Absolutely, but I said "loving", not "worshipping". Loving one's own country is a natural emotion. Nothing wrong with it, until it becomes, like you said, worshipping.

I don't know. I mean, you can't love Jesus without worshipping him, now can you?

I don't know. I mean, you can't love Jesus without worshipping him, now can you?

Why? I love Jesus, but I don't worship him.

Well, there are people who would say that loving Jesus without worshipping him is not really loving him.

So... I guess I do love my country, but not in the way the status quo would want me to love it. To the status quo, I would be an infidel and a heretic.

So... I guess I do love my country, but not in the way the status quo would want me to love it. To the status quo, I would be an infidel and a heretic.

Screw the status quo then. Each loves the way he can. There are no laws for love.

Agreed. So how's your new girlfriend?

Agreed. So how's your new girlfriend?

She's good, thanks! We just finished watching the second Lord of the Rings movie together. And now I'm working on my new hentai RPG article, while she does something with her Mac, probably homework or something.

You're asian rpg article had a very passionate romantic undertone to it - a sort of glorious celebration resembling something like.. hmm... Beethoven's music. Romantic nationalism of asian rpg's.

Mine was really a propaganda of a sub-group and a justification of it's recent dominance over other sub-group's, by trying to show it's moral superiority over the "lesser" rpg types. So it was actually very imperialistic, racist and evil article.

What's your narrativist intention (historiography, metanarratives, political subtext, etc) for hentai rpg's?

Screw romanticism. My hentai article is even more evil than yours. I'd call it "sarcastically nihilist", because it savors the good old days of hentai RPGs, only to condemn the genre to further nothingness. A bit like an old Casanova who can't have sex anymore, but keeps panties from his favorite lovers in all the drawers. So my article can also be called "decadent".

As for the narrative, I want to drop the pseudo-scientific tone of my previous article. It'll be written in colloquial language, with platitudes and bad jokes with an occasionally good one (if I succeed, which is doubtful).

I assume that the theme itself will evoke enough interest, without me having to resort to stylistic tricks.

No political subtext but the satiric bit about how capitalism has destroyed hentai RPGs.

A lot of that mirrors my own perception with the situation here in Ukraine. Thankfully, the Ukranian culture is much closer to Russian and the fact that I live on the border with Russia makes it practically impossible for me to hate "anything Russian". In fact, I love everything Russian, especially Russian language, cuisine, smell and the beauty of Russian girls. ))

Nevertheless, I hate Russian history of conquest and the way it substituted the current nationalistic idea of great and proud Russian history that's always twisted to fit the daily political agenda of the government. There are practically no second thoughts. Russia (as some nonexistent united, undivided entity spanning thousands of kilometers) is always right, always been right, and for the end of time will remain right.

And I still want Ukraine to remain independent, even though I don't care much for the idea of "nezalezhna Ukraina'" either, because it's practically the same artificial contstruct you refer to. Not that it ever was anything different. I'm just sure that any separatist tendency will ultimately result in blood, just like in Georgia. Especially considering that Russia has proven itself quick to jump the gun already.

I love both cultures of either Ukraine or Russia, even though they can't clearly be separated as much as many hardcore Ukranian nationalists want. I just hate it when culture of the countries I love is brought to poltics and geopolitical debates, to support ideas that I completely resent.

Russia (as some nonexistent united, undivided entity spanning thousands of kilometers) is always right, always been right, and for the end of time will remain right.

That's what I call "Imperial Thinking". It is characteristic for all large and powerful countries, not just Russia. You have the same kind of thinking in the USA, in China, etc. Power and size - you can't be wrong when you have those...

Yeah, but where does much of our personality type come from? Educational background and upbringing. :o)

Folding your socks in the evening? You're likely to do every side quest in RPG's.

I don't fold my socks. My girlfriends/wives do that for me :/

Okay, let me guess then: You don't do every side quest in your RPG's, right?

BTW how many girlfriends/wives do you have currently? ;o)

Okay, let me guess then: You don't do every side quest in your RPG's, right?

Right :)

BTW how many girlfriends/wives do you have currently? ;o)

Just one girlfriend :) But two ex-wives :(

I know in Australia we like the idea of super violent games, manly because our laws don't allow these games to be released, and we seem to like what we can't have. I think the appeal for these games will reduce if these games are released to the public

That's right: I like good games that challenge me to be my best. I don't play games to learn about some convoluted story that is more complicated for its own good whose plot is advanced by random-turn based battles or by defeating bosses to unlock a cutscene. Like SOME people. Playing the game itself and "winning" should be the reward, and not any cutscenes you can unlock just by beating the game on the easiest setting; the difference is that an emphasis on the latter produces more games with suckage.

But I digress. As loathe as I am to say it, I do think that there is a ethnic cultural sensitivity to video games just like any ART(gimmie italics) form. Even though I'm agreeing with the 'Corn, I would say that exceptions aside, every country/homogenous ethnic area has its videogame preference. Say for example, USA - FPS, China - online RPG, S. Korea - Starcraft.

While these are base generalizations, and there are always exceptions to the rule, I think it's important to take this as a rule to note that people of the same culture think and act similarily if not the same, and not this Benetton ad "hey-brother-we-are-all-the-same-people-deep-down"deep down garbage. Let's not be liberals and say, "There's no difference between you and me; we are just human beings". To be proud of your own ethnic heritage is to distinguish it as being separate and special from every other ethnic heritage. It goes to stand that if some ethnicity is distinguishable in some trait, like they like to manage and organise, or they like to maintain face and high status, or they like bagels and lox, then it should also be suggested that they like a certain genre of video game.

This become noteworthy as we see the shift of power in the production of video games shift from the East to the West (well, it's pretty much already happened). Video game companies pretty much make games tailored to their own culture and ethnicity; that's why certain games seem offense and outrageous to those of us outside the culture; say, for example, the ignorant racism of Resident Evil 5 or that crazy hentai stuff (loli doesn't stand for Laugh Out Loud Indubitably) - we don't get it because we're seeing it through another cultural lense. Anyways, as the West is able to push its own culture and perspective upon the rest of the world through the terrible art of video games, I think we'll start to see resistance from the rest of the world. Already China has censored WoW (not a good example, but they did - boxes and boxes of them).

Agreed. Even we Germans are slooooooowly re-learning this 70 years after the beginning of WW II. :-|

I thought nerds weren't supposed to mingle? I'm practically Chinese when it comes to gaming...cultural comparison.