🕹️ New release: Lunar Lander Beyond

Forums > Game Forums > Renaissance Heroes: Starter Bundle > consumable items only? DLC debate

user avatar

Rola (8483) on 7/15/2013 1:36 PM · edited · Permalink · Report

Are these all temporary or consumable items? Maybe we should make a rule about non-permanent content not eligible as MobyGames entry? This is the first time I see such DLC here.

user avatar

vedder (70822) on 7/15/2013 7:26 PM · Permalink · Report

You have my vote. This opens the floodgate for iOS in-app "energy" purchases which more or less every game nowadays has half a dozen.

user avatar

Patrick Bregger (301035) on 7/15/2013 8:35 PM · Permalink · Report

I agree. We can't cover micro transactions. I'd say that the concept of calling something "DLC" for free-to-play games is ridiculous by definition.

user avatar

Sciere (930490) on 7/15/2013 8:42 PM · Permalink · Report

All right, but not the ones where you receive a permanent new item?

user avatar

Kabushi (261204) on 7/15/2013 9:21 PM · Permalink · Report

This is equally silly. A single song.

If we did the same with Guitar Hero and Rock Band, we would get thousands of entries.

user avatar

Sciere (930490) on 7/15/2013 9:51 PM · Permalink · Report

We take it more or less as granted that no one will add them (go Indra), but it's hard to argue objectively that an additional song you pay for isn't the same as DLC that offers an extra level.

user avatar

Indra was here (20755) on 7/15/2013 10:13 PM · Permalink · Report

schemes mischievously

Told you, we'd open the floodgates, but does anyone listen to me? Noooo.....

In other news, I have for the first time in history managed to surpass Sciere in game contributions. I'm so happy I could masturbate. There, I said it. :p

user avatar

Indra was here (20755) on 7/15/2013 10:26 PM · Permalink · Report

Though in all seriousness, our agreed upon policy somewhere down the road is that we cover game releases, not just games per se. Which makes it a bit confusing when under the subjective microscope of: is that a game?

Until we started accepting speech packs and other minor game-related material, so all's fair in game junk add-on contribution department, I suppose.

Only thing we need to start figuring out, is what types of releases should we start to deem as unworthy? Fan-based Mods? I would agree for most cases, but could argue against total overhauls, which would an exciting addition for this database. Remember that Ultima VII: Pagan mod debate we had for Dungeon Siege and its developers? I've felt a bit weird ever since, but policy is policy.

The floodgates are open. Now decide where we want the river to flow.

user avatar

Indra was here (20755) on 7/15/2013 10:28 PM · Permalink · Report

...and also, in all fairness. I do hate that meine DLC contributions are equated by the system as equal as game contributions. That's not fair and I feel like cheating. It's eating at my soul, if I had one. :p

user avatar

Fred VT (25953) on 7/15/2013 10:48 PM · Permalink · Report

It all comes down to how games and their DLCs are managed. The Game Group option doesn't quite do it for me. It would be fair if DLCs was a different type of submission altogether...

user avatar

Sciere (930490) on 7/15/2013 10:51 PM · edited · Permalink · Report

In the late nineties it was never considered here to have patches as "expansions" with game entries, even though some of them had extensive additional content. It all changed when updates turned into commercial add-ons; that no matter how the small the additions are, you are to pay for it. It's because MobyGames is organized around ownership, remember the "what you can buy" mantra that defines a game entry. Having separate game entries make sense for a lot of DLC (credits, screenshots, release date) so it can't just be dismissed, it's a part of documenting the game, and that's why it's now practice for a costume pack to have a game entry and free modifications people have worked on for years are not allowed. If two types of DLC adhere to the same sense of ownership, you can't distinguish between what's worth a game entry and what is not, that's entirely subjective. Maybe you put on a horse's costume or play a new multiplayer mode for 2 minutes, but play a game's new song for weeks. But you paid for both of them. A lot would be solved if DLC could be organized as a sub-game entry, tied to a specific game with full documentation, but not listed alongside with equal independent status. Since that would require a programming intervention, not going to happen.

user avatar

Fred VT (25953) on 7/15/2013 11:27 PM · Permalink · Report

[Q --start Sciere wrote--]A lot would be solved if DLC could be organized as a sub-game entry, tied to a specific game with full documentation, but not listed alongside with equal independent status. Since that would require a programming intervention, not going to happen. [/Q --end Sciere wrote--]

Yeah, well at least we document them now, so the data is there if that update ever happens. But what about individual songs for RockBand and the likes? Should I start adding them? ;P

user avatar

Indra was here (20755) on 7/16/2013 12:16 AM · Permalink · Report

Well, if you're a points whore, go ahead and add them. I've already started and us whores have to stick together.

I need to go to a shrink and deal with this sexual frustration I have going on lately. :p

user avatar

Fred VT (25953) on 7/16/2013 12:39 AM · Permalink · Report

Not so much a point whore, put a completion addict. Which means that if I get a list, I have to use everything I can from that list, and I won't rest as long as there's something I can add to the database and know where to find the info.

...Maybe a bit point-whorish too XD

user avatar

Indra was here (20755) on 7/16/2013 6:38 AM · edited · Permalink · Report

Well, I second the reasoning of completion for completion's sake. Since most of our concerns in handling these issues will eventually mean some sort of programming overhaul, the most feasible option for now is, paraphrasing from the fundies, "add 'em first, let god sort 'em out later."

user avatar

Sciere (930490) on 7/15/2013 10:47 PM · edited · Permalink · Report

Indra, please, don't add my name in the same sentence as your masturbation habits. What is wrong with you.

user avatar

Indra was here (20755) on 7/16/2013 12:13 AM · edited · Permalink · Report

You should be more worried about the other habits I have going on. :p Don't ask. What has been read, cannot be unread.

user avatar

Rola (8483) on 7/16/2013 5:19 AM · edited · Permalink · Report

Regarding the "one song DLC":
I also consider them as "extra level", so they do count as add-ons.

However, the point is that they're a bit... supernumerary? It's just too much and should be avoided.

Just as we didn't add every single extra downloadable level, even if it was officially released by developers, as new entry (see the cases of extra maps for, say, Ground Control). As mentioned above, some patches/updates add so much content that by analogy they should get own descriptions...

  • We're peer-review database, so it absorbs our small (and shrinking?) workforce (maybe we could reconsider if the publisher's PR were submitting this info and we had 10 times more approvers)
  • As Sciere pointed out, it clogs and taxes our outdated system. And the update from the present game-groups-collect-expansions solution is not going to happen in the coming days...
  • ...because if we add one song, we should add all Most present-day DLCs are similar to old updates/expansions that were either available in retail or as mail-order.
    Now, coming back to this new type of DLC: I say we make it a rule that anything that's not permanently available to the user account (added/unlocked content) shouldn't qualify for new entry here. No consumables, no matter if it's just a "bag of gems" (which you spend to buy stuff) or "a superior starfighter" (that once lost must be bought again, in real-life). No temporary boosters.
  • user avatar

    Pseudo_Intellectual (66362) on 7/16/2013 6:25 AM · Permalink · Report

    The rule of thumb would be "please don't waste our time", except that of course I have made numerous submissions that violate that rule 8)

    user avatar

    Indra was here (20755) on 7/16/2013 6:35 AM · Permalink · Report

    Well, you're one of the few contributors bored enough to still add interactive fiction games in the 21st century. :p

    Besides, it doesn't get much worse than adding those five minutes flash games. Game? Yes. Add it to the database? Er. No, we have taste (subjective).

    user avatar

    Pseudo_Intellectual (66362) on 7/16/2013 3:27 PM · Permalink · Report

    Hey, many of the IF games represent significant milestones. (Then there is the 99% of new IF releases I skip over.) Where I'd draw the line is probably releases that don't even excite their authors, and eg. it's hard to imagine anyone getting fired up over designing a single-use DLC.

    user avatar

    vedder (70822) on 7/16/2013 5:45 PM · edited · Permalink · Report

    You haven't met much marketing people? :)

    user avatar

    Fred VT (25953) on 7/16/2013 4:21 PM · Permalink · Report

    What about those free to play/buy if you like games like those from this site? http://www.dlsite.com/eng/fsr/=/language/en/sex_category%5B0%5D/male/sex_category%5B1%5D/female/ana_flg/off/age_category%5B0%5D/general/order%5B0%5D/release_d/work_type_category%5B0%5D/game/work_type_category_name%5B0%5D/Game/genre_and_or/or/options_and_or/or/per_page/30/show_type/n/from/fs.detail

    Would they be worthy additions to the database? I bet some people would happily try and add all the adult games there :P

    user avatar

    Kabushi (261204) on 7/16/2013 5:54 PM · Permalink · Report

    There are no limits on how obscure a game on MobyGames can be. And that's one of the best things about the site.

    user avatar

    leilei (343) on 7/16/2013 6:07 AM · Permalink · Report

    It'd be terrible if Indra just added things like one 30 Attack Items to the database.

    user avatar

    Rola (8483) on 7/16/2013 6:24 AM · Permalink · Report

    It's terrible enough that this game got released. Such scams should be banned!

    user avatar

    Indra was here (20755) on 7/16/2013 6:32 AM · Permalink · Report

    I would if it were on Steam and if I knew what an iPhone is. :p