Pagan: Ultima VIII

aka: Super Avatar Bros., Ultima 8
Moby ID: 723
DOS Specs
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Ultima VIII: Pagan begins where Ultima VII: Part Two - Serpent Isle ended. The Guardian banishes the Avatar to the land of Pagan, a world under his control. Stranded in this unknown land, without his companions to help him, the Avatar's goal is to find a way back to Britannia. He has to confront four Titans in this world who are embodiments of the four elements, as well as master different styles of magic and fight many opponents on his way.

The gameplay is significantly more action-oriented in this installment than in the previous Ultima games. The Avatar is able to jump and climb, and some puzzles are based on these abilities, adding platform-style elements to the game. There are no companions to help him in battles; combat is action-based and relies on the player's dexterity. The game also abandons the leveling system of the previous entries, utilizing instead a training-based approach, similar to the one implemented in Quest for Glory games: the character's parameters are increased by continuously using correspondent actions (e.g. the Avatar's strength gradually increases as he swings his weapon).

Magic occupies an important place in the game, also departing from the style of the preceding games. The player still needs to gather reagents for spells; however, the exact preparation and casting of the spell differs depending on the elemental school it belongs to. There are four different magic schools in the game, and mastering their spells bears plot-related importance as well.

Like in the two previous Ultima installments, the game features physical interactivity with the environment: the player is able to take, drop, and move most objects from place to place. As opposed to the topic-based dialogue style of the earlier games in the series, Pagan uses conversations with selectable responses. It also reduces NPC interaction, focusing more on exploration of a hostile world and combat.

A speech pack was released separately, which added voices to some of the major game characters. It was included in the CD-ROM edition of the game.

Spellings

  • Ultima VIII: פגאן - Hebrew spelling

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Credits (DOS version)

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Reviews

Critics

Average score: 81% (based on 19 ratings)

Players

Average score: 3.8 out of 5 (based on 79 ratings with 9 reviews)

If it ain't broke, don't fix it.

The Good
*2nd update. Minor changes, hated the last One-line Summary.

When I say this, I probably would speak for all Ultima fans: WE DID NOT EXPECT THIS. Which isn't really a problem, only that statement was meant in a bad way. But, I'll explain that in the "didn't like part".

Actually the game isn't bad really, quite good actually although I never thought in my worst nightmares that Ultima would actually have an action version...aaaaaaaah!

Anyway, better graphics, better sound, more complex, more everything. The key here is realism...they made a good job out of that (although the Ultima fans might disagree...I'm one of them).

I must admit though, that the combat is very much entertaining. Not much strategy in the combat though, just click-click-click. The magic is more complex, more variations. Pagan has more variations and is more complex than its ancestors in addition to much detailed animations.

The Bad
Although personally I like the game, I am obligated as a hardcore Ultima fan to say this: OH MY GOD! OH MY GOD! OH MY GOD! WHAT HAVE THOU DONE?" (Repeat as many times as possible) - which is basically the essence of all the other reviews...

Change is usually good. No one is really against change, especially when it comes to Ultima. They made a brilliant change from Ultima V to Ultima VI. Now, they tried challenge tradition again. But this time at least to my opinion.

They really did a good job in making Ultima Pagan, but they failed big time in the most important things. They failed the fans and they failed the Avatar.

Everyone loved the Ultima VI-VII game engine. We were used to it and we still weren't bored of it. We loved the story, we loved the characters in the game, we loved the ideals and morals in the game...and they took it all away with this new concept.

I have never "felt" so alone and lonely playing a Ultima game. I always thought that you'd be stuck forever with Iolo, Shamino and Dupre...even if it reached Ultima 100. The game is playable, but I probably experienced a "gaming cultural shock". I experienced the same thing while playing Ultima VII...knowing Merry the Mouse couldn't join the party. Well, now they've totally screwed it by eliminating all team members.

This would be a great game if it was a standalone. But it's not. It's part of the Ultima Series, the Legend...and they ruined the legend - The Avatar without a Soul. Now I'm really depressed. :p

Now combat was a major dissapointment for any RPG fan. Probably because the combat DOESN'T EXIST! Combat like I said in this game is - Click, Click, Click. Who thought of THAT incredibly stupid idea. No strategy whatsoever. Every monster you see is "click'em" to death. If only there were a "block or parry" button with it...

The Bottom Line
ULTIMATE CULTURE SHOCK (valid only for hardcore Ultima fans). A great game really, especially if your not familiar with Ultima.

DOS · by Indra was here (20760) · 2004

A big stretch, and a big departure from the previous Ultimas.

The Good
The graphics and sound are very good, and the mouse interface is fairly easy to learn and use for character control.

The Bad
It's almost nothing like all the other Ultimas. In fact, if you call it something else ("Land of Pagan", for example) and name the hero something else ("Gunther" instead of "Avatar"), you'd never know it was made to be an Ultima.

Also, combat is kind of tricky since it's real-time and mouse controlled. You can swing your weapon (normally used), or kick your opponent. Kicking is rather silly, I think, and contributes to the "Super Mario Brothers" feel of the game.

The Bottom Line
All the jumping and kicking aside, this is still an okay game to play. However, I think you'll like the other Ultimas better.

DOS · by Mirrorshades2k (274) · 2000

Good Sequel, The last good Ultima...

The Good
The great atmosphere, nice graphics and dark setting gave the game a distinct and unique look. The Avatar now alone and in hostile territory, had to find a way back in Sosaria in order to defeat the Guardian, there are no virtues here, only nasty elemental gods to rob of their powers. The Avatar has no allies and needs to steal, trick, and murder in order to escape Pagan. The premise is great along with great story writing and general ambiance.

The Bad
The scrolling is atrocious, even on top notch hardware the background seems to shift behind the Avatar's feet and the animation lack frames and look bad. The rendered graphics looked good at the time but did not age well, when playing you can notice the repetitive "tiles" that form the backgrounds, some of them don't mesh well with the objects. Really annoying jump puzzles and lack of a party to speak of drag the game down to a watered down action adventure.



The Bottom Line
A good game with a huge heritage that falls kinda short of expectations

DOS · by Paolo Cumin (11) · 2007

[ View all 9 player reviews ]

Discussion

Subject By Date
Any Western action RPGs before this one? Unicorn Lynx (181780) Sep 9, 2014

Trivia

Cancelled add-on

The planned add-on The Lost Vale was all but finished and ready for duplication before it was cancelled in September 1994 due to poor sales of the main game. In September 2005, a prototype of the game box appeared on eBay and was sold for almost 2000 dollars. Its authenticity was confirmed by Origin artist Denis Loubet. More information on The Lost Vale, including a scan of the box, is available at PC Games That Weren't.

Engine

The Pagan game engine was recycled in Origin's Crusader series.

Pentagram

Richard Garriot used pentagrams as gameplay element because he thought the superstitions - many people believe pentagrams summon the devil - are ridiculous. During development, a few people actually left Origin because of this. After that, Garriot used the pentagram on the cover which caused some US retailers like Walmart to refuse carrying the game.

Plot

In the previous games, Avatar is rated mainly on compassion and doing good deeds. In Ultima VIII, the Avatar must turn all four planes of existence upside down by destroying the Titans of each plane, in order to escape. Many fans believed that this storyline ran counter to the spirit of the Avatar and the entire Ultima series.

Reception

Pagan was not well-received by long-time Ultima fans. A large number of them ridiculed the action and platform elements of the game, dubbing it "Super Avatar Brothers". The alternate nickname this game was known by is "Super Mario Avatar". Only a different wording, but still making a point about the gameplay and jumping puzzles.

Richard Garriott, the producer of this game, admitted himself that it was released too early, incomplete and with too many bugs. The patch Origin released soon afterwards corrected most of the issues and made jumping easier. The CD ROM release is already patched.

References

  • Like Ultima VII, the game contains a reference hinting at the mighty corporate power of Electronic Arts. In Mythran's abode, a magical, morphing object appears, which continuously changes shape between cube, sphere and tetrahedron, and labeled differently during each change. These are the items the former EA logo was made out of.

When double-clicking the item, the avatar kneel and says: "I have not the strength, nor the wisdom to master such power... but one day I shall!". Obviously, Richard Garriott was behind this. * Check out the graves on the graveyard - on one of them there is the following epitaph: "Here lies Arnold. Hasta la vista baby!" An obvious reference to the movie Terminator 2.

Release history

At least in Europe, there were two different releases of the CD-ROM edition (not counting the budget releases). The first one came in the same box as the floppy disk release, with a "CD-ROM" sticker added to distinguish it from the floppy-based version. It included the speech pack, but was the same otherwise.

The second version had a redesigned box and was released in 1995. Unlike the first CD-ROM edition, this one was fully patched to fix all the bugs and plot holes that the game originally had.

Titans

The names of the four Titans are Greek words, that correspond to the elements the Titans represent: * Pyros (fire) * Lithos (earth) * Stratos (air) * Hydros (water)

Tumbling Avatar

In the original release of Ultima VIII there was the feature, that the Avatar, when hit hard in combat, fell on his back and had to get to his feet again before he could continue fighting. They later removed this in the patched version because players considered this very annoying. But you can still watch this feature when fighting a creature named Changeling. If the Changeling has taken the shape of the player and so you are fighting "yourself", the false Avatar will still fall on his back when he gets hit.

Awards

  • Computer Gaming World
    • November 1996 (15th anniversary issue) – #20 Worst Game of All Time

Information also contributed by Kasey Chang, Sciere, Terok Nor, Unicorn Lynx, WildKard, WindowsKIller and xcom1602

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Contributors to this Entry

Game added by Terok Nor.

Additional contributors: Trixter, Ye Olde Infocomme Shoppe, G. Ganesh, Jeanne, Apogee IV, Pseudo_Intellectual, Crawly, phorque, Patrick Bregger.

Game added January 11, 2000. Last modified February 11, 2024.